Response to Mormon Comment

The initial comment by "arringtonzoo" to my last post on Arminian security really struck a chord, so I'm compelled to give my response on the main page.
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arringtonzoo said...

I really liked this entry Mike. Good thoughts. Question for you though. According your following quote, "It definitely doesn't seem like God would string someone along, giving him a passionate desire for the gospel, empowering him to live the Christian life, experiencing conviction of sin and repentance, and then condemn the person at the end." Would you say that it is possible then, in your mind, that a Mormon (and one who remains true to the LDS faith) could be saved? And if your answer is yes then how is it that one who is saved according to the grace of Jesus Christ is not a Christian? (Referring to the popularly held belief by many Christians that Mormons are not Christian). And if your answer is no, then how do you explain your above comment? I cannot speak for all members of my faith but I can speak for myself and I can see it in others. I have a passionate desire for the gospel. I have been empowered to live the Christian life. I have been convicted of my sins and repented, and do so continually! I recognize the grace of my Savior as the only means by which I can be saved in the Kingdom of God. Tell me, how is it I am not a Christian? Tell me also, who was given the authority to make that judgment call? It truly saddens me. I need no one, no one, to tell me that I am a Christian. I know what I am.
4:20 PM

Mike Mitchell said...

You raise a number of important questions. I'll try to address them one by one.

The first question is "How is it that one who is saved according to the grace of Jesus Christ is not a Christian?" This raises a general question Christians consider and debate often: can those who are not professing Christians be saved if they die without becoming a Christian?

One non-negotiable point in genuine Christianity is that there is no way for any person on earth to be made right with God except through Christ. However, I do not believe it necessarily follows from that fact that all people who die without becoming a Christian are automatically condemned. Maybe (and I'm only speculating) God works in the transitionary process from this world to the next so that each ignorant person is given an opportunity to hear and accept the reality of Christ? This would make a lot of sense in the case of people who have lived their entire life span in parts of the world where they've never heard of Christ. But ultimately only God knows the way this does and doesn't happen, and those to whom it happens. But if someone who does not live the Christian life is, in the end, saved by the grace of Christ in some unconventional, mysterious way, that doesn't change the fact that the person did not (maybe never had the opportunity to) live a Christian life.

The other question you raise is, how can Christians say that Mormons are not Christians when so many Mormons have "a passionate desire for the gospel" and are empowered to live the Christian life and have have been convicted of sin and repented?

In response to this, it's hard to know where to start. The first thing that comes to mind for me is the question of why Mormons today would ever want to be thought of as Christian? Mormonism is founded on the idea that all of Christianity fell away--"apostasized"--around the 2nd century, and for the next 1700 years or so all that went under the name Christianity (with the exception of a few rare and isolated individuals) was apostate and evil, worshiping God with their lips, but with their hearts far from Him. The Mormon Prophet Seer and Revelator, John Taylor, said the Roman Catholic Church was the whore of Babylon and the Protestants were its "lewd daughters." So why would you ever want to be numbered with us anyway?

To your point about being a Christian because you have a passionate desire for the gospel, everything hinges on what you mean by that word, "gospel."

If I were to dream up some religious doctrine that said that God Almighty was once a man—that he began his existence as a human being and developed into God, and that all human beings were in the midst of the same process, and that if we obey that former-man-now-God person as he sends us commands through chosen prophets, that we too would be able to become a God and create and populate our own planet—if I were to dream this up and then apply the word “gospel” to it, and say emphatically that those who believe it have a passionate desire for the “gospel”—that would not make those people Christians. When you say you have a passionate desire for the gospel, that gospel is no more Christian than it would be if someone applied the word “gospel” to the Noble Eightfold Path of Buddhism or the Five Pillars of Islam.

Likewise, when you say you’ve been empowered to live the Christian life, the life you’re talking about centers on temple endowments, temple marriages, baptisms for the dead, dietary laws, obedience to the President of the LDS Church, etc. and none of these are Christian practices. None of these are aspects of the Christian life.

How can this be more clear: Joseph Smith taught that God is an evolved human being; Isaiah (and every other Biblical prophet/writer who addressed the issue) taught that God is infinite and unchanging—that He is eternally constant in strength, power, goodness, etc. They cannot both be right. And there are many other colossally important doctrines that are equally contrary between Christianity and Mormonism. I could go on.

Simply using Jesus' name and borrowing terminology from those who follow Him does not make someone Christian. Jehovah’s Witnesses recognize the existence of Jesus; they are not Christians. Muslims recognize the existence of Jesus; they are not Christians. It is what we believe about Jesus and how that belief affects our behavior that makes us Christians—and the litmus test for this is how consistent our beliefs and practices are with the Bible, and secondly with 2000 years of Christian history.

Most Mormons I’ve met are people with high moral standards, most of whom I would trust to babysit my kids or manage my bank account. But they are not Christians! Now whether or not all who are not Christians in this life will be eternally separated from Christ is for Christ alone to decide.

But I have to say one more thing before leaving this post. The “gospel” the Salt-Lake-based Mormons are passionate about is not only inconsistent with the gospel of Christ, but with the gospel of Joseph Smith as well. It’s extremely hard to describe the exasperation I feel when I hear upstanding Mormons express scorn and disgust at those nasty, filthy, pedophiliac polygamists out in Texas who have recently been arrested. And yet those same Mormons will swell with pride and reverence at the mention of Joseph Smith or Brigham Young—whose lifestyles were a thousand times closer to those Texas polygamists than to that of President Hinckley or President Monson.

My wife recently had a baby. Once when visiting the gynecologist’s office in Provo with her for a check up, I saw in the lobby a beautiful painting of Joseph Smith sitting on the side of a bed in which a woman (presumably Emma) is lying holding one infant while Joseph holds another. It’s a tremendously tender, moving scene, evoking strong emotions for family and parenthood. But the one question I couldn't get out of my mind was, “Which wife was that?!” It’s documented that he married thirty-three women, and others are suspected but lack documentation. To be disgusted with the Texas polygamists is to be disgusted with Joseph Smith. Those of us who know much about Mormonism know that those who have followed Joseph Smith with integrity have recently been arrested in Texas or are living in Colorado City or Centennial Park Arizona—still practicing polygamy, still hating blacks, still at odds with the U.S. government—just like the early prophets of the LDS Church.

Lastly, you asked about authority. To cut to the chase, just read Paul’s short letter to the Colossians in the New Testament. There’s the ultimate Christian declaration on authority (as is the book of Hebrews). If there were no other available books in the Bible, I can't fathom how anyone who accepts the Bible as Scripture could remain Mormon after reading Colossians.

Please don’t mistake my frustration for arrogance or meanness. I want only to speak the truth in love, which demands honesty and candor.

MM